Cross Marian Dead or Alive

[Sinamon]

right, lenalee's innocence was screwed up before it crystallized but she wasn't physically separated from it like kanda was physically separated from mugen, even though they are both equipment types.

what has me thinking is the fact that, even though kanda's innocence has also evolved into the crystal form, people think that it makes lenalee's innocence not special anymore. however, allen and lenalee's innocence are still the only ones that actually protected their accommodator when their lives were in danger. kanda's innocence, for some reason, just disengaged from him. i suppose a katana is easier to lose than boots but i wonder why his innocence didn't try to save him? maybe because his life really wasn't in danger?

[TunaSFX]

Well... Kanda escaped pretty safely. He just left his innocence with allen. so nothing really bad was happening right? Also, Lenalee's boots, she rarely takes off, there was this episode in the anime where she cried when she wore the nurse's boots because they were so warm compared to the dormant form of the cold and heavy darkboots and yadidadida. So yeah, its true that a katana is easier to lose.

[kalla]

Lenalee's innocence was with Hevaleska if I recall...she took it? (or am I remembering that wrong?) Kanda's was with Master Zhu so maybe Hevaleska prevented Lenalee's from acting the same as Kanda's.

Another way to look at it might be that Kanda had not yet decided when he left with Alma what he would do if he survived. (He may not have anticipated surviving.) Because he hadn't died, his innocence rusted rather than reverted back to a fragment. Once he made his decision and came back, that choice is what made it crystallize.

I don't think Kanda's innocence tried to save him because it tends to act in accordance with the exorcist's will. Maybe that is why the choice is so important for the crystallized form? In order for it to give that much power the innocence needs that conviction first. When Lenalee's and Allen's protected them, both of them wanted to live. Not that Kanda wanted to die, but I don't think survival was something he cared about--he cared about accomplishing his goal, not what happened after.

[TunaSFX]

yeah i agree with kalla's second paragraph. The innocence was probably waiting for Kanda to make a choice of his own free will. When mugen rusted over every presumed him dead. He was free to go around to do anything he wanted. He didn't have a choice before, but now he does and he chose to be an exorcist.

Another factor we havent considered is what exactly happened after they landed in matel. Other than Alma having last words or something what happened after that? We don't know yet but whatever happened there may have affected his decision into coming back.

[Sinamon]

yeah, lenalee's defunct innocence was given to/taken by hevlaska after lenalee came back from the mission. it makes sense since she houses all innocence without accommodators and are stored within her until they find one. i guess my point is that the circumstance in which lenalee's innocence parted from her is different than kanda's as is the way in which the innocence was returned. but the biggest difference is the way in which their respective innocence reacted during times of peril.

along that line, i don't know if i agree about the innocence acting in accordance with the exorcists' will part. they do have a partnership but the innocence seems to have a will of its own apart from the exorcist. i think it's true that it needs to feel the conviction from exorcists before it will evolve into the crystal form for them but in terms of saving their lives, i think that's something completely apart from the will of the exorcist. i am sure daisya wanted to live but his innocence perished along with him. as did general yeager's. if kanda wanted to live or even just save alma, his innocence might have been able to do something. instead, it stayed behind and didn't act on its own like allen's and lenalee's did. as for lenalee, her attitude going into the eshi fight was her acceptance that it would lead to her death and she was ready for it. but her innocence had different ideas. this is why i think that there's still something a little different about allen and lenalee's innocence or why they share a connection, even though now there are two crystal form innocence in use.

[TunaSFX]

I think Kanda getting the crystal form of innocence is to throw us off into thinking that lenalee may not be so different anymore. but as Sinamon pointed out. Only Allen's and Lenalee's innocence so far has saved thier lives and have their own will

[kalla]

I agree that Allen and Lenalee's innocence is different. But I think the innocence does need the host's will and acts accordingly. A lot of exorcists don't want to die, but accept that as a potential outcome. Even with Daysia, he may not have wanted to die but if he accepted death at that point his innocence may not have reacted as it could have. Allen and Lenalee have, in my opinion, the strongest will to stay alive and fight no matter how the odds are stacked against them; they want to come out alive to keep fighting. The others want to live and fight, but as when they were in the Ark, they are more likely to relinquish their life so the others may continue. I don't mean that to sound like Allen and Lenalee wouldn't risk their lives because they would, I just think their will to survive no matter what is stronger. Hard to explain...

And yes, I don't think the innocence always acts in accordance with the host's will although it is entirely possible that the host is unaware of his/her true will when clouded by emotions of a present situation. When Suman was placed in a situation where he knew he was going to die, his will to fight changed and the innocence rejected him. However his reasons were selfish, albeit understandable. For Kanda the motive underneath I think was righteous not selfish. Yes Alma was his friend, but he was freeing Alma from bonds that should never have been placed on him. Perhaps the innocence freed Kanda's own bonds in return? I don't know that Kanda was aware of the true motivation at the time; to him it was finally ending the saga, but I do think the innocence responds to the true will of the host by either acting in accordance with the host or rejecting him/her.

That said, I do agree innocence has some ability to act on its own, but like any parasite it is dependent upon the host. In this case, I just feel the innocence feeds of the the will of the host rather than something more tangible.